My Cafe Racer Build (and Re-Build)

[motoTrooper]

Show the exhaust side profile too! Moar photos!

I'm wondering how some roller rocker arms would increase power on your engine. Probably excluded in the race rules but could be a help at high rpm.

 

[pamcopete]

wolfe_11B,

Your PAMCO XS400E-HD ignition is on its way to you. Please remember that the installation instructions are V 1.0. You are a pioneer. We have sold a ton of these systems to the Honda CBXXX twin market and the one thing that bubbles to the surface is that users are not aware of the fact that the MCU is a very dynamic device. So, follow the instructions carefully. It helps to get the idle down to 1,000 RPM when setting the timing because of the inaccuracies of the tach. The MCU, like all computers, works with the data that is presented to it. In this case, the data is the time between the magnets which is used to determine the delay from full advance to the appropriate advance. In other words, the device is a retarder, not an advancer, as are most electronic ignitions with an electronic "advance". If your idle engine speed is slightly fast, like, 1300 RPM instead of 1200 RPM, then some of the available advance will be used and you will have trouble setting the timing because of the introduced advance which you will try to compensate for by retarding the timing until you run out of plate movement, or if you do not run out of plate movement, you will not get full advance because some of the available advance was used at idle. Sounds like fun, huh?

The instructions talk about setting the left side timing first and then adjust the PC board for the right side. Well, sometimes it will be necessary to simply move both sensor boards for the desired results. If the right side is late, the move the boards closer together. If the right side is early, then move them further apart. A real PITA, admittedly, but once set, it's forget.

 

[Wolfe_11B]

Thanks for the info Pete. I'm sure it won't be that bad to get going. The only pain I'm going to have is juggling all the unknowns on first startup! I've got new carbs in that I need to pray work decent on first startup, I need the ignition to be close, and need to bed in the new cam.

 

[pamcopete]

Thanks for the info Pete. I'm sure it won't be that bad to get going. The only pain I'm going to have is juggling all the unknowns on first startup! I've got new carbs in that I need to pray work decent on first startup, I need the ignition to be close, and need to bed in the new cam.

If you set the ignition to the recommended initial position, the engine should start to enable you to set the timing and get the carbs half way there. It will probably take a lot of back and forth and trial and error but just be patient. The sensors are set initially to be 90 degrees apart, but things get in the way, like the timing chain. Once set, however, you should not need to readjust again unless you do some major work to the engine.

 

[motoTrooper]

Wouldn't it make sense to reduce the variables and use the old ignition to dial the carbs in and then add the new one to the mix after? Seems like you've got a lot of new variables in this engine and there might be a fair amount of





before

 

[xschris]

I would do the same. Your plug and play factory TCI would make it much easier to get everything else sorted first.

 

[Wolfe_11B]

Unfortunately nothing is plug and play on my bike. I would need to do a complete separate wiring job for the stock TCI now. Not impossible to rig it all up, just not worth the work at this point. As long as the timing is within the ballpark it will run.

 

[Wolfe_11B]

Hey Pete, is there an open through hole pad on the sensor side of the edvancer I can use for my rpm trigger wire? If not I'll just use the coil or tap the wire, but I'd like to avoid it for the sake of clean wiring.

 

[pamcopete]

Hey Pete, is there an open through hole pad on the sensor side of the edvancer I can use for my rpm trigger wire? If not I'll just use the coil or tap the wire, but I'd like to avoid it for the sake of clean wiring.

You can use the green wire to the coil, but DO NOT use the sensor wiring as it is directly connected to the MCU. Your tach should be specifically compatible with an electronic ignition. If it worked with your TCI from the coil, then should be no problem. Be sure to observe the labels for the sensor vs coil wires. They are not interchangeable. The sensor is not capable of driving the coils directly and will be fried if you attempt that.

 

[Wolfe_11B]

Got the bike started on first blip of the switch yesterday. It's got some major issues to contend with that will have to wait til after the holidays. The Pamco ignition works, but I had a hell of a time with a few problems that I'll have to let Pete know about privately. Might be issues only that pertain to the TCI model 400's. But I got it working with modification. The next issue is carbs. I'm having problems that I've never dealt with before, and quite frankly defy all carb logic. When started, the RPMs race up to 4k and sit. First thought is slides up too high, or super lean. Well I removed the throttle cables, and made sure the slides are slammed shut. Still does it. Checked the wideband, running pig rich at 8to1. Turning the air screws makes no difference on the ratio. Then get this- pulled the enrichers (chokes) and the AFR goes to a perfect 14.7to1 and idles at 1000rpm. Boggles my mind. I really don't trust these junk Mikes XS Oko PWKs. I'm going to order some legit carbs, possibly a set of FCRs if I can find a decent used set(not cheap).

 

[pamcopete]

Wolfe_11B,

Glad you got it going. Lets hear about the problems you encountered here so we can all learn from your experience. I don't see where you could have a problem only associated with the TCI models as all of the TCI components are removed and no longer used, leaving the engine in the same configuration as a points model.

 

[Wolfe_11B]

Ah they really aren't huge deals. The main plate on your ignition is about 0.20mm thinner than the stock cam sensor plate. My mic showed 2.05 on the Pamco and 2.25 on the stock. The Pamco plate would just spin free with the screws completly tight. To remedy this I just transfered the boards to the stock plate.

Second issue was getting the 2 sides firing evenly. I understood the concept on how they work by moving them, but ran out of adjustment by moving the boards as far away as possible. I was able to slightly bend the sensor on the right cylinder board left, and the left cylinder sensor right, which made everything fire at the same time. It now works perfect.

So basically a tiny bit thicker on the plate, and a tiny bit more adjustment on the boards would be perfect!

 

[pamcopete]

Wolfe_11B,

I have ordered some new plates that will be 2.5mm thick. I changed the 8-32 holes to 6-32 holes to provide more room for adjustment. I'll send you a new plate when they are delivered to me. Thanks for the feedback.

 

[Wolfe_11B]

No problem Pete. The only thing I could think of is that the machining on the TCI head and valve cover is a tiny bit different than the points models.

 

[xschris]

I wonder if there will be issues with the outter covers fitting on bikes that came with points. The tci covers are much deeper than the points bikes to fit the factory TCI pickups.

 

[pamcopete]

I wonder if there will be issues with the outter covers fitting on bikes that came with points. The tci covers are much deeper than the points bikes to fit the factory TCI pickups.

We have sold a lot of the original PAMCO that use the stock mechanical advancer without a clearance problem. The E-Advance model rotor has the same height and diameter as the rotor on the earlier model. Also, the beta tester with the very first E-Advancer did not report a problem with clearance. Why don't you buy one and give us your feedback?

 

[Wolfe_11B]

Yeah there is a ton of room between the rotor and cover now with the Pamco. I have no doubt it clears the old style fine.

 

[Wolfe_11B]

On another note, oil leaks! I thought I was scott free, but today while running it I found a leak from the valve cover by the right front. Way better than a crankcase leak. I'll have to pull the cover and reapply the Yamabond. I went really thin with it, obviously it wasn't enough in that area. No leaks anywhere else.

Decided to ditch these carbs officially. There is a local place here in Cleveland that sells jets, so i grabbed the smallest pilot they had (20). While it leaned out my idle a bit, its still too rich. These carbs are just too much for the motor.

Ordered a set of VM28's. Won't be much to get them going fine.

 

[xschris]

We have sold a lot of the original PAMCO that use the stock mechanical advancer without a clearance problem. The E-Advance model rotor has the same height and diameter as the rotor on the earlier model. Also, the beta tester with the very first E-Advancer did not report a problem with clearance. Why don't you buy one and give us your feedback?

As many people know on the forum, I am the guy with many new and used xs400 parts After owning one for 17yrs and now having 4 of them I pick stuff up when the price is right. Not including the ignition systems that are on the bikes now. I have two NOS TCI boxes that I picked up for under $50 each. Four working used ones, one with only 8miles on it and four TCI pickups that test to new spec. I only have invested $150 total for all the parts and doubt I will ever need to buy any more. It's nice to see there are other systems being made for those that don't have the stock I have. Thank you pete

 

[Wolfe_11B]

OK so I'm an idiot. Either my tourqe wrench is out of calibration or I just simply forgot to tourqe the valve cover down. Oil leaks fixed.

Carbs are perfectly fine. Runs and idles great now, getting perfect 14.7 on the meter, 1k rpm. Problem was the slides hanging up even with the cable off, so it was a combination of the junk MikesXS cable, and bad springs in the carb. All good now. Short video for ya. Too bad cell phones have bad sound, the exhaust sounds very nice!